– All right, so let's get started. Would you like to
introduce yourself, Mark? – Yeah, absolutely. So my name is Mark, and I run the Instagram
account Men Who Bullet, YouTube and Instagram and all the things. And excited to be hanging
out with you today. – Thanks. I'm excited to be hanging
out with you today, too. It has been a hot minute since I've been doing videos on YouTube. – Yeah. – Yeah, it's definitely been over a year, which has been- – Has it been that long? – It has actually been that long. It has been, I think the
last one was not last year, but the year before, August. – Oh, my gosh. – Yeah, so it has been– – You're busy.

– Well, there's busy, and
then there's avoiding YouTube. So.
(both laugh) – I love the process of YouTube. I can't get enough of it, but I think it's just because, I don't know, I like that
creative process, so. – I think, you know what? I think it was that one video I did, and it just put me off for a little while, and I needed to regroup a little bit. – Understandably. It was a hot one. – It was a hot one, it's still a hot one. People are still hot on that one.

It still gets tons of views. I'm a little bit surprised. I think maybe I need to do a follow up. (Mark laughs) – You need one of those
messy bun, apology videos or something like. – I didn't mean to say anything crappy about your crappy company. (laughing) Woops! I'm gonna get in crap! Now I'm gonna have to
do two messy bun videos. All right, anyway. (both laugh) So, I thought it would
be a great opportunity just to have a chat about
all the journal staff, what you've been up to,
what I've been up to, things that are happening
in the community, things that are new
things that are different, things that are seem to be trending, just cause I have taken a break doesn't mean I'm not
all over the community, like a hot rash.

(laughing) – I know. I think that's, I think it's a big misperception is that if you're not posting,
you're not paying attention. I mean, I know there are
some people that just like, kind of get over it and
don't come back to it. But then others are just like, I just don't have the creative, you know, juice right now to like
do those types of things. And I'm always, you know,
for me, I'm always like this, you know, post whatever. I think other people are kind
of overthink it sometimes. And I understand that
you want it to be nice. And all of that, I've just gotten to the point
where I think my style is that I, I do care.

Don't get me wrong, but like, I just want to
have things out there. Yeah I'm not curating my feed, the way that I felt like
I needed to before now. I'm just taking pictures of
the things that I'm doing and the things I'm using and just talking about like
my love for those things or whatever it is. And I'm finding that people
are really engaging with that. I don't get a ton of likes or you know, anything like that.

But the people who are
commenting the community though around it is, is big. Like I'd rather have
people be like, oh my gosh, I'm doing that too. Then just like it for
the sake of liking it. So, you know, I'm, I've always been on that. But I think I also had to like get to a point where I was okay with that. I know for a while I was like, oh no, this has to be great. I also think I came in at a time and you were here before, like I say here before,
but like five years ago, I remember a lot of the
people we hang out with now and chat with, they were all here before. And it was like the height
of bullet journaling fandom. So everyone was so used
to getting, you know, thousands of likes and tons of engagement. And then it went down to like hundreds and they were like, no, one's
engaged with my content. And I was like, I got 150 likes.

I've gone viral. It's I still feel that way. I still only get that many sometimes. And I'm like, this is awesome. So there's a thing that I found recently, it was called it's
called viral for me VFM. And like, that's a part,
you know, you celebrate, what's gone viral for you. That could be 500 likes on something. 'Cause for me 500 likes
on a photo on Instagram is more than I usually ever get.

So I'm like, yes, this is,
you know, this is great. Then I don't care though. I'm just having fun. – I need a viral for me. – You do. It could be anything. Post one thing. This video is going to be viral for you. – Its gonna be viral for me. Is there a antiretrovirals for this viral? (laughing) – I don't know. Should we stop talking
about viral right now? Seems like a little hot topic.(laughs) – The topic of the minutes. Tell me how, how has
COVID going in your area? What's what's happening over there? – So it is, it's super
stressful right now. My wife's a teacher. And so she's, you know, she sees 600 kids during the week and you know, my kids are at school and everything else like that. And they're, you know, they're in school, but out there, they're around groups. I'm not, I'm still working remotely. And it is stressful sometimes because this new Omnicron variant is getting everybody sick. And it's just, it's, everyone's just super nervous and on edge. And coming back from the
holidays, they're basically, we're just like be prepared
because it's going to just be running rampant.

So there's a lot of concern, especially at schools and
things like that around it. Luckily everyone in my
family has stayed safe and you know we're doing weekend by not really going anywhere, so. You know, that's why also everyone's like, how do you do somebody videos? I was like, we don't go and do anything. So, you know. – Yes. It's definitely a different world. I think we live in at the moment. – Yeah, it absolutely is. So it's just, you know, making sure everyone's
safe all you can really do. I think for me, it's been really interesting
too with like working right, working remote. I've worked with the number
of remote team members for years. And then after, you know, two years ago it became
just like everybody was. And so I liked the idea of a hybrid. I liked being around people, but I think it's also really
great to be able to be like, Hey, we're being safe right now. It's not great to be in large groups. You just don't know and like hang out.

And we know that we can still do our jobs. It's not like anybody like that, but I know that we're in a
very kind of similar thing, like a privilege kind of space to do that. Not every job allows for that, so. It gets super difficult. – Super, Yeah. So tell me how has, 'cause you know, we, we started chatting about
a thousand years ago. – It was I remember it very vividly.

– Oh you do. (laughing) – I remember it so vividly because it started off as one of those fun engagement groups. And I want to say you were moderating it. I want to say maybe and the
reason maybe, maybe not, but I remember someone being
very strict about the rules and I was the, it was the first time I'd ever
been a part of an engagement group and I was like a baby
bullet journal account. I don't even know. I didn't have that many followers or like maybe like a thousand or maybe I don't remember
this one or that five. I don't remember, but I remember getting
invited and I was around you. And who else was in there? Hailey I think was in there. – Would it been–
– Rose. – Rose, would have been Rachel. Aaron would have been in there. – Yeah. – Bonnie would have been in there. – Yes. Yeah. That's how I think how we
originally like all met my darts and all the thing too, but yeah I remember
reading that and just being so intimidated because
you all were like these ginormous accounts and all of that.

And it was just so funny because as we naturally do, it was like, when you post,
you got to post the link here and do all that stuff. And then it was funny 'cause
we were all doing that. And then we started chatting and then we started to get to know each other a lot more. And I'm, that's why I feel like it was you because you were such as rule follower, which knowing you more over the years is really funny to me now. And you were like, we're gonna create a whole
separate chat for this. 'Cause this is a chatty bunch and we're gonna put your things here and you're going to chat over here. (laughing) – And chat here, separate. – And separate it. And so it was, it was great. And then that chat is
my longest running chat and it's been cool.

And I think from that though, it's been awesome because
it's like you just said, like Bonnie was in there and she was kicking
off our turn all of men to see how that has
evolved over the time too. It was really neat, but I'm still just, I feel super honored to even
have been around a lot of you. And now you're just my friends. Like am just like Oh my.
– Now we like going neats. (laughing) – It is. Its so funny. – Oh plus Boston wasn't there, Nicole wasn't there. – She wasn't there that's
right for the beginning. And then everyone got stressed out because of it, because
those engagement groups are a lot of work. I don't think anyone
realizes it until you do it. It's like, it's a great idea and it's
good for like a month. But then after that, I'm always like, I couldn't keep up. 'Cause you were like during the day and you made like rules around, not you, but like rules
for the engagement group.

Right? It was like post comment, like within the first
10 minutes or something, I'm like out of work, I'm driving. I'm like, I don't want to
get kicked out of this group. I'm new here. – Am just typing and texting am gonna press my likes. – And it was, it was cool for me though. So it was awesome as a whole.

So that was super neat. But yeah, I mean this past
year for me has been amazing. I'm still kind of blown away how much I've grown in this year alone. But I think a lot of it is just, I'm hoping a lot of it
is just like organically people getting to know me more, me engaging more, trying different things. The reels. I know that a lot
of people don't love them, but I think that also was
a really big thing for me just because I was
trying to do that over on TikTok and it just wasn't happening for me there. And then it was like, they
brought it over to Instagram and that's where my people are.

And then I could finally
show more of my personality through that and just have some fun. And that kind of started
to grow it too. I think. And then this year it's just kinda crazy. Like I was just looking today. I was like, I just hit 21,000. And I was like, how did that happen? Like a month ago I was celebrating 20,000. How did I get to 21 all of a sudden? And it's just super cool. And same thing with YouTube. Like someone just commented
on my set of video when I set it up, I think I had like 6,000 subscribers there and then they just commented today. They were like, whoa, like in this video you said
you had 6,000 scrubbers now you're at eight. I'm like, oh, I didn't even know that
I was, this is awesome. So this has been like a lot of growth. Yeah. So it's been really cool to like have that happening. And I always, I don't feel bad.

I'm, I'm glad to celebrate it. But I remember earlier
at the end of last year and like middle of last year, when a lot of people were
losing a lot of followers, I felt really bad because I was growing. (laughing) – And you doing it behind
closed doors and you like. – I was, everyone was
like, screw the algorithm, Mrs. BS. I'm doing everything I can do. And I'm over here like I'm
doing everything I can do and it's working like, but yeah, so it's, it's been really cool. And I like to celebrate those little wins. I think that's kind of like
my mantra for this year is to celebrate the little wins because that's what makes me happy. And while I loved like hit
the big monstrous goals, I find that, you know, just setting small little
steps and going at it has been really cool.

So that's been my real big focus. So like just do more of that. – Nice. – How about for yourself? – Over this last year tell me, What has been the most
gossipy thing you have seen on in the community? (laughing) – Oh gosh, I knew that these are
going to be tough questions and I didn't know that in my head. The most gossipy thing. So I, I want to say the most
gossipy thing that I feel like it's been kind of talked about is like bullet journal proper coming out and accepting more of the creativeness of what is, and I'm glad about that. Like, I'm very happy about that. – We all are. – Yeah. So that I think
is the biggest thing is, 'cause it was like, wait, what's happening here? Because was it two or three years ago It was kind of the opposite.

Right? Where a lot of people were getting mad because this all started with
the bullet journal method. And then it was almost like the, it was the battle of the journaling. It was, are you a creative journal? Or you're not a true bullet journal? Is, you know, following the method and then it kind of like subsided and then it kind of came back. So I think that was the biggest thing.

I mean, I'll, I'll be very
open and transparent, you know, I it's been cool. I have been a part of kind of this like I don't know about like a restart program or kind of a little bit of more of like an affiliate type program with them. So I'm very open and
honest in that group too. I don't like sugarcoat it. Like it's cool. 'Cause they get to like– – Have you ever sugarcoated anything? – Well, yes, I have sugarcoated some things, but there's both certain things, especially when you have that opportunity to like speak up and you know, this, I was the
same way on the design team. Like if something's out there, I'm going to say it in a nice way. I'm not going to be rude about it, but it was just like, Hey, what's going on here? Like what are we doing? And it was cool because
with that specifically, I think we'll see more of that coming out.

It was not necessarily
about how you do it. It is. It's the how and the what right. Or the how and the why of it. But I think it's going to
kind of took off I'm like this weird direction where everyone
thought you had to do it this certain way. And what was missing was the true value of bullet journaling. Like what it actually is. And I think that people were getting, they were getting mad at the system when they just weren't actually following the actual method and
that's why it was failing. So I think that's the most gossipy thing, but I do feel like it's going
in a really good path now it's cool to be a part of it and see kind of how that's happening and I'm talking about like
the actual reason behind it. So for me, I feel like that's
the most gossipy thing.

I don't really know if there was any thing there was that one person I don't really follow
them, but, or I do now, but y'all might've been talking about them where they got upset
about affiliate marketing and they did a whole YouTube
video on affiliate marketing and how it was like not
the right thing to do. And it was, I forget who it was though. She was like a big personality and curses a lot in her videos. – I don't remember. – I don't know. That was the only other
thing I can think of that was like gossipy because
people were like, wait, affiliate marketing is good. But their video was like, no, it's you know, you're, you're prying on other people and taking their money and we shouldn't be doing that right now, but not just, I don't know.

But yeah, that was, I don't know. Again, I wasn't really gossipy, but I remember like talking about it and being talked about in the community. 'Cause the people, I
mean, that's how people make extra money. So affiliate marketing. And I think if you're like greasy about it and you're like trying
to like swindle people, yeah it's not cool. But if you're talking about products that you're excited about
and other people are too, and you're putting out the effort and somebody wants to use your code to like show support, like
I'm all about it, but– – And they're fine. – And it might have been around that. Yeah It's the video. I think it was more about like the like sneaky people who do it versus like, Hey am not feeling it.

– You do see a lot of
that on, on Facebook. Right. Where a lot of people
will just be like, oh, what sort of notebook are you? Could you recommend? And then you've got like
37 people commenting, use my card to buy this
really cool notebook. It's free shipping. Oh no, stop wait like three comments in. We should have maybe not done that. – Yeah. – 'Cause that, that to me feels like it's not genuine or like that you're actually
trying to, you know, say actually I'm really behind this brand. So tell me, what is your most to date What is your most favorite
notebook you've ever used? – Wow. My absolute most favorite notebook I've ever used. I have, I have two for two
very different reasons.

So I would say my favorite and this has nothing to do the fact that we work
with Archer and Olive, but it's my very first
Archer and Olive notebook. And the reason that it's
my favorite notebook is that I was coming from
the Loi-strums, the old ones. And that paper was so thin and it just ghosted horribly. And I remember the first time I like wrote in that Archer and Olive and I was like, is this magic? – What is that? (laughing) – It was. And it was very cool. So it was a really awesome experience. And I just, I'll never forget. I think it was also one, two. It was very early on.
And Bonnie was like– – Was it like one of the smaller ones? Like on of the smaller that they find – No, it was, this was this guy. I don't know if it was a
smaller size they find, but it's just, I think it was like a 192, like one of the, just original, just blue.

And this is also early on
too when like a lot of the notebooks were not, I, they weren't. Oh look, oh, you got
like one of the oh jeez – Its not even an A5 size actually. – Oh yeah, I wasn't that early on, but just I just remember like– – I have even an A5. – That's so funny. Yeah. I just remember being like, I guess it's the only color I can get. 'Cause everything was like flowers and color and everything else. And I was like, I'll get the blue one. (laughing) So that was cool. And then my other favorite one was, is actually Baron Fig
it's the do-work journal. So it's such a hard one because I love everything about it, but the paper was a little thin for me. And I also got it after I'd been working at Archer and Olive notebooks. So like when you go from never
having ghosting or anything like that to something that does, you have to like kind
of mentally overcome it and I'd worked in it, I
actually really loved it, but it is more of a guided journal.

It's going to set up
every single day for you. So you do that. And I loved it and it
was work-focused too. That was the other thing
too. So it was like, what are your weekly goals and your tasks and then every day you were
carrying those things through. So those are two, I know you said like my most favorite I'll say like my number one is this just cause it was my very first and I loved that I could
like do anything in it and I didn't have any that ghost and you're bleeding and then the other one's like 1.5 just because of the productivity,
like usefulness of it. – Fair enough. That makes sense. I'd be, I'd be hard pressed to say one of my favorite is my very first notebook
of all time of all time was a Moleskin and I was like, it was Moleskin.

And I was you know, when you look at the OG sort of BuJo vibe like OG BuJo, OG BuJo with that, this is like a 2016, maybe 2015, 2016 – Wow you are really early on. – And I was really lazy and I just printed out
sheets that I stuck in. 'Cause the paper was so thin and I was just like, well,
I'll just print that sheet to make it work for me. – Have you ever done a
flip through that journal? – I've never done a flip
through that journal. – You should do. – I'm like, Oh my God, like it's even got like super cute, adorable old school sticker. – Yeah. Seriously like that is such a fun one to go through because you're there, I'm coming up on five years
of bullet journaling in April.

And I have just all of these things about like what I've learned about it and I've flipped through some
of those old journals too, but it's just so fun to do that because it also shows like how your brain was working. You know, you were like, I have to figure this thing
out and how to do this. So I'm going to print pieces of paper out, put them in there instead, they're like, versus like
now how you could do it. I think you can probably
see, I don't know. I'm going to assume, I don't know that I've seen your journal. – Oh no, now its just like a big mess. – Oh, it's a sketchbook. (laughing) – It essentially just a notepad, like a giant fancy notepad. Every so often I'll make like, if I'm bored or if I've got a
bit of spare time on my hands, if this is actually a poor, like if I'm bored or if I've
got spare time on my hands, then I'll make it like a
nice spread, but overall.

– But you're not doing, but you're not following like a good bullet journal method. You're creating your own journal. – Usually its a mess. – Brainstorming and– – Yeah its mainly brainstorming. And then, you know,
seeing how I can do things or design things. And there's a lot of notes and a lot of scribbles and
scratches and et cetera. But yeah, my personal favorite
is my B5 Archer and Olive. I can't like, you know what people have, like people always come at me about, oh, it's because you work for Archer and Olive or, you know, you do design team staff with Archer and Olive. And actually, no it's
actually not that at all. I've had every single
notebook of all time. – You have a lot.

– I have every single notebook. If you name a brand, I've had it. And look, there's a couple
that are really like, you know, this, those lovely temporary
matris or temporary miris, those are lovely and they're thick and they coated they're like
what Scribbles That Matter used to be, you know, like the nice coated paper with it. Like it was really nice. – Yeah. I've never, I never had
a Scribbles That Matter. I know a lot of people were big on them. I really only my, my journals over time
essentially had been the Loi-strums to begin with. And then it's been a lot of
Archer and Olive notebooks, but then again, a lot of those Baron Figs, but some of those I hadn't really heard about. That was the other thing too, when I first started, I mean, it sounds like it'd be,
you were really into it. Like the stationary journal, like all of those different things. Like I was trying to figure out, I didn't know a lot about it coming into it. So I've learned a lot over time.

I even know myself, I catch myself where I'm
talking about like GSM paper or I'm talking about
like pen quality or ink. And I was like, oh my gosh, I've learned a lot in
these last five years. (laughing) Before I was like, I love this big pen. It's fantastic. And now I, like, I went
through my pen drawer, my wife's pen drawer the other day. And I was like, what is this? Like one of those like
cheap, like, you know, the ones you get from like
a store or like, you know, a giveaway or something I'm
like, get rid of this crap. I'm like put all my nice ones in here now.

(laughing) – I got my pen bag at work the other day. And someone like reached into my pen bag. And my first response was like. What are you doing? – Yeah, like your good pen
bag, not your borrowed pen bag. – Yeah like my pen bag that I was using. And I'm like, no, no, don't get your sticky
fingers on my nice pants. – No way. I it's so funny. I was talking about that. 'Cause when I went back
to work for like a day before they were like,
y'all need to go back home. I unpacked my desk and I set up a pen holder and I had to throw away so many pens that they were just like exploded and just like everything
else from being, you know, in a box for the past two years. And I was thinking, I
was like, you know what? I'm gonna keep some of these here. 'Cause that way, when
people ask you for a pen, I'm going to be like, oh, here's you gotta have this one.

And I'll have my own like secret
stash over here for myself. – Have this really gross pen with like a little thing that pulls out of it and tells you what it does. They're like a calendar. – Yes. (laughing) – I've been in the cap off of this one. You can use that. No, I wouldn't give them that one now, but I had a lot of those. (laughing) – So tell me you have been super into posting on reels at the moment. How's that been going? Because you spoke about it earlier and you've had some really, really, really fun reels recently. You have especially that
one that has spoilers time. That was just, that got me right excited. I'm thinking.

– You are so fun. – I think we should totally make that like a regular recurrence. – Oh, I think it has to be. People still were asking me afterwards. What's so funny about
it is that, you know, over time you make like
different friends, right. As you go through this community and an Erica caffeinated who own the design team now, her and Kay from Stuck on creations. Like we just started like
chatting on the side anyway. Especially before when the
application of things came out and overall we just became like another like group of friends. And so I pass my ideas by them a lot and I was totally like, you know what I should do 'cause you know, people go wild in the spoiler groups. I was like, crazy. I was like, it'd be so
funny just to do that. And they were like, just
do it, Mark, just do it. Like, and I was like, I don't know.

I don't think people really like it. Like, I don't know, but maybe they'll think
I'm making fun of them. And I did the one and I was, I mean, I, I was just cracking up the
whole time that I did it, but it's funny because it's
kind of mixed ways about it. I was just watching a video
today that was talking about like, where should you post your videos? It was more kind of a business based one. It was like, do you use TikTok? Or do you use Instagram reels? Like where should you do it? And it was talking about like demographics and breaking it down and all of that. And it was talking about like, it was saying, if you're
going to post like a trend. No, I'm sorry. If you're going to research trends, research trends on TikTok, because Instagram is two weeks
late to the TikTok trend. So it's about a two-week time period between when something is trendy on TikTok to when it's be on reels.

Which I found very interesting. – Thanks mark, top tip. – Yeah, no, absolutely top tips. So, but the thing is, is you're gonna have a hard
time finding those sounds on Instagram because they
haven't made it there yet, but you could certainly be the
person who brings it there. But like I said before, I consume a lot of content on TikTok for entertainment it's
like watching TV for me, but sometimes you'll find ideas there. And so everyone's like Mark like how do you
come up with your ideas? What do you do? And so I tell them all the time, like my secret right here
is like, you watch them, you have to watch them, but like find out what's
trendy or something funny.

And then just kind of
like it into like morph it into your niche. Right? So like we deal with
stationery and notebooks,– – All the time. – And all this type of stuff. Right? So like if you find something funny, think about how you could incorporate that into what you do and then the community will like it. So when I hear these like funny sounds and someone's doing like a dance to it, I'm like, well, I'm not gonna dance to it. I'm going to do this instead. And it's just been super fun. – If you are not gonna dance
to it I'm very disappointed. – It's really funny because I felt about that
when I first started, 'cause I was like, okay, what's gonna grab people's attention. Like, what is everyone else doing? And I couldn't do the like point thing that everyone else, like all the other people were doing, like the things popping up.

And I was just like, I can't, I don't have anything of value to, I think I made fun of it once. (laughing) 'Cause it was, it was like, that's all you saw, but it's just like funny
those and having fun. I loved like the transitions
and I love like the creative process of making them
like more than just that, like my wife hates it because she's like, if I have to listen to that
damn sound one more time. And I'm like, well,
'cause it keeps replaying as you recording it. (laughing) – Yeah and then you like I can just, it's almost like it's
almost once it's posted, you're not going to hear it again, but just give me a moment just one moment. – Yeah, every time we put
it in like a text box, it's like, you got to play it again. (laughing) So, so yeah. I mean, I'll be honest. Like I love, I love doing them. I, some of them I do spend time on, right.

Like the, I would say like
the ones that took the longest to create are definitely
the newsreel ones, the Harry Potter one that I did a while back, took a long time. And then the shape, the
acrylic grass shake weight ones I did, like those take a long time. Yeah. 'Cause I had to like watch it. I had to, I had to like try to memorize like what they were saying and like dress up and do all
the different things for it. And edit it together, right? That's the other part. But for some of the quick ones, I mean, I can film, like I can film four or five
reels and under 10 minutes, just because I've already
thought through in my head, like, what's the concept for what might I do? – Yeah. – And then, you know, do 10
to 15 seconds of the thing. And after a while you
start to get good at it, like early on it didn't
take me that quick to do. And not all of them are that quick, but like they don't need to
be movie level creations.

– There's supposed to be
fun and engaging, right? They're supposed to be, you know, something that's kind of
a little bit more organic and like, oh, this is kind of goes to Yuan. You know, I look at some
of those curated ones and I'm just like, how, like who, what, what is
your target audience babes? (laughing) Who are these curated people
that I know nothing about as she subs her MTY now. – I know do the refill. Can have you having
empty wine on this call? – Yeah. So I'm really, I've been really impressed by
how you re integrated yourself into the community after
leaving the amazing design team. – Oh, thanks. Oh, I had to find a way
to still become relevant and that was a great way to do it, so.

(laughing) – I, you know, don't really know if like people are gonna forget about you, but no, it was super fun. I mean, I love doing those. Like I said, I plan on, I want to come up with like
different ways of doing them. I was thinking about, I don't
know, do I give it away? I don't know, millions of
people are gonna watch this, the all new ideas. So I did the newscast for
that subscription box. I was thinking about doing
like a trashy talk show theme for the next ones. So like a Maury Povich, like, you know– – Like a Jerry Springer. – Yeah like Jerry Springer, like something along the lines of that. – Jerry, Jerry, Jerry, Mark, Mark, Mark. – Exactly. So, yeah. So I'm, that was just an idea. But sometimes again, like, I don't think through them a lot, sometimes it just comes
to me like, I'm just like, that was one of those random things. It was a complete joke. And then Erica was like,
you have to do that.

And I was like, I don't know. And then an hour later I had
the first one put together and she was like dying. She was like, okay, so you did it. And then it got such great reaction. And I was like, I guess I have to keep doing this. – You have to keep doing it. Its now a thing. – Yeah. And then now
people don't trust me. Like, you're like, Hey,
want to see this thing? Don't take any screenshots.

And I was like, no, no, no, no. I respect, I respect the things. I would never do that. But in those times of making that happen, it's cool because that's
the spoiler group. It's like, you know, it's like, everyone's so excited and
they're like joining together and we've all got on our like red string and like, you know, push
pins, figuring stuff out. And then it's like, once we
figure it out, then it's like, it's like, everyone starts
cannibalizing themselves. It's insane. And I was like, oh, okay. I'm done with these sneak
peeks now I'll be over here.

(laughing) – So we took back feedback on that. We took feedback and
we've said, all right, for the next subscription box, here we go. You can have a sneak peek breaking news. We've said, what we're gonna do is because some people really like the sneak peeks. Some really don't. So we've decided to split it in half. What we're going to do is we're gonna do like a third system. We're gonna show everything for one third. We're going to sneak peek a third. And then there is a third of things that no one will know
about until they arrive. – Well, there's that much stuff. And then a subscription boxes. (laughing) I mean, that's amazing. Is that just for the next
one or moving forward? – Okay.

Well, we're gonna to taste it for the next one to see
if that hits the model. – I mean, I just actually, I mean, before, when I was on the design
team, like obviously we, we got those right? But once I wasn't, I signed up for it because I just, I love the idea of them and I love the stuff and I might not use everything in there, but I think a lot of people
put it a really good way. Like, it's the excitement of getting it. It's, you know, the excitement of like having those things that might
not ever come out, right? Like that's super cool. Like people always ask me
about my ruler that we got, I forget which subbox that was in. But like I use this all the time. People are like, where's that from? how do I get it? I was like, no, like this isn't a subbox– – They never getting that.

– No they've never released it again. And I kind of, I was like, mine's breaking a little bit. I've used it so much. But like, that's just one of
those things where I'm like, and no one will have that. Or what did I post the other day? It was something from the very first one. It was like the magical box or the colors. I did something with the colors on that. And it was funny because
people were like, oh my gosh, that's some of the first one. Remember that very first. So I love that idea. I think that's great
because I love the surprise. 'Cause other people's subscription boxes. You don't know what it
is until you get it. So you can't complain about something. You know, I guess you could
complain about it afterwards if you wanted to. But I love that idea. I think that's really cool
to like, be like, Hey, here are a few things. Here are not a few things.

And here's, you know,
you're not even gonna know. – And these things you'll never know about until they arrive in
your grubby little mitts. (laughing) – I'll be ready for them. – This subbox, the Sneath subbox they've started arriving and I'll tell you something else for free is they're pretty bloody awesome. – Every single one has been
pretty bloody awesome for me. I think I'm just a big fan. So. – Well the last you know, the purple one I just call of the purple one, I dunno. The one that– – The big one. – The big one, I feel like, I feel like they were a
couple of disappointed people, especially with the size of the notebook.

And I think really only people
kind of got on board with that after they'd heard what
the justification was for that. And you know, that we do put a lot of intention into the products and we put a lot of. – Yeah, it definitely felt it's funny. 'Cause I actually forgot
when I got my box, I filmed a whole unboxing, but I feel like it's been so long now since it wouldn't really
be a relevant video. But in that video I talk about that. Like it reminds, it was almost, it was a very carefully
curated box, right? And not to say the other
ones are not curated. They are, but they were kind
of more of like a jumble, a jumble of things, but like
different things in there.

But this one was like, here's a notebook that you
can use with this thing. Here's the inserts that go in here. Here are the gel pens that
work with this notebook to do. And so it was almost more like a kit. Yeah. It was more like a
kit than it was necessarily. I'm not, I got it. You can do the company can do whatever
it wants with their products.

But I definitely can understand that where it felt like that. 'Cause those other ones were
just like, I don't know. Remember I still remember like before the, like the Acrylographs were like, those weren't even a thing yet. And people were like so excited about it or maybe they were what came first, the chicken or the egg, they were Acrylographs out before the first subscription
box with those colors. Okay. – No, yes no, wait, the
Acrylographs were out. And then those, that first box had two
unique colors and colors I think that we'd used
in the past from memory.

– Oh maybe, that could be more– – Was that a valentine box See now I can't even remember. – So I was going to say that
could be the drama thing. 'Cause remember we were like, these colors have
already been used before. – And they are like can it be it? Am so confused. – I was like, I can't tell what the difference between most of these colors are. So if you say so, can I
get names on these please? (laughing) – Am wearing purple now. – I would say you're
wearing yellow or green. That's usually that I
know it's in that family I don't know which exact color– – Its in that family,
now I'm wearing yellow. – Yellow, okay. – I wear yellow all the tine now because hashtag team yellow. – Wow okay. – That's you know I like live team yellow I live and breathe it now.

Yeah. That's like, that's quite a bit that's changed I guess since we like, so this last year to now, or the year before that. Okay. So do you have any questions for me? – So obviously thinking about this when we were like any questions to do. So I was gonna do a notebook or stationary F, marry or kill. So I was like, this could
be really good to do. So I was going to do this
for brush pens, right? So you got to, you had F one, I'm keeping this PG for the
kids or kill one. Right? So Tombow brush pens, the Collograph Archer and Olive brush pens or the Dingbats brush pens 'cause I've used all three at the moment. If you've used all three,
but I've used all three. – Right. Yeah. I've used all three of them. I would absolutely. Oh, absolutely kill Dingbats. I'm not interested.

– Really. – They re they fray
really quickly not keen. – Okay. – Tombow, the old school
nature of it makes me one to marry it because it's an OG. So I would probably marry them just due to the OG nature of them and due to its unique tip and it's,– – There you go. – I would absolutely. – The tip was a little bendy. – Out of those calliographs. Let me just love it right now.

– Yeah. There you go. It takes a hard, but flexible tip. That's what you're
looking for in your brush. – Especially one that I'd
like to F as a hot tip. – Perfect. I'm glad I thought about that question. 'Cause I literally was like, what are some questions for her? So I had that one for you. So you did that one. So my next, so my other question for you was I don't want to trigger anything, but when you've taken your brakes on, like let me put it this way, right? So when I first got to know you and I was terrified of you, no, I was intimidated and terrified of you mostly because of the engagement group.

And I was like, oh my God, she's gonna hate me. But then we became kindred
spirits over the time that we've known each other. All right. All right. So when we first met, right, you were heavy into my inner creative, you had the blog going, you had the Instagram account going and like I tagged you every post so that you would repost my stuff one day and then it kind of like stopped. I was curious on if there's
anything specific that was like, yeah, like I've had, whether I don't know, was it I've had it's too
much, it was overwhelming. Or was there like a specific
point where you're like, this is more important
than keeping that up? Like, was there any certain thing? – Kind of channeling your
energy a little bit more.

And it just came at a time when, you know, the out of BuJo, which was kind of the OG
reshare account, right? There was, there was a woman who didn't get reshared and she got really angry about it and got all of her friends to report the account and got my account
taken down for like a month and a half.

And I was just like, well,
this is really frustrating. 'Cause one of the things
that was really important to me with the art of BuJo was to make sure that
I asked for permission that there was, I was one of the first
accounts that really pushed don't do copyrights infringement, make sure that you're
asking explicit permission when you're sharing things, you know, make sure that you've, you know, make sure you've just ticked all the boxes and you've been kind to people like just make sure you're doing that. And she didn't like that I
hadn't reshared her stuff. So I got on board with
a whole bunch of people.

And when I did find me reshare her staff, but she claimed that it was
a copyright infringement. So I got all their
friends to jump on board and report the account. So it was really frustrating
and it was just like, I've put a lot of energy and effort into kind of creating a community that feels a little bit more wholesome. And I don't know, it just felt like a gut punched and it kind of put me off
Instagram for a little while.

So I was feeling a little down in the dark so that I can give
YouTube a bit of a crack. Why not? Gave YouTube a crack. And you know, then there was the contentious notebook therapy YouTube. I'll link it below. (laughing) I'll link it below and I'll
turn off the damn comments. No I will leave the
comments alone is fine. I've grown a bit of a thicker skin now. And you know, I, I think
what really frustrated me about that was, you know, I was talking about my experience with a company that, you know, not everybody's
gonna have the same experience, but my experience was pretty shitty. And it wasn't just one
time, it was like two times, three times.

And I was like, Hmm, this is starting to look
like a theme and a trend. And then to have all of
their minions run off with pitchforks, I'm just like, no, that is not what I put myself out before. I'm sharing that. I didn't like the notebook. I didn't like what it had to offer me. That's just my opinion. It doesn't have to be your opinion.

Mark you like Loi-strum. I'm like mm hey I don't
like Archer and Olive. But like we do right? Like different stuff. I'm sharing what I like. I'm trying to be as objective as possible. And it was around that time
that I'd started doing a lot more design team work for Archer and Olive where I was on the design team with you remember where
I was like, come on guys, we've got to get that content out. And we were on the design team. We would, you know,
doing stuff for Bonnie. And then we kind of that kind
of morphed into actually, do you need some help
managing the design team? And that's kind of morphed into, do you need help doing something else? Do you need help doing something else. (laughing) where we are now. – Yeah, it's crazy. I mean, it's awesome how it's
evolved since then for you. Yeah. And I didn't know that, I didn't know that the whole
thing about the art of BuJo and like that getting like
taken down on all of that.

'Cause that was, there was
like a handful of those. And especially early on,
like when I was coming in, that was a way to grow your
account was to get reshared. So like going and doing that,
but I can totally understand. – Like I was just really upset. – You know, where it was. Absolutely. That happens
I think anytime that, that goes down and you're just
kind of like this wasn't my intention, you know, I wasn't
trying to cause problems, especially with that in resharing and then for the video itself, but you had done a whole series of videos about notebook reviews. Like that was a part of a series. Wasn't it? – Yeah, it was. And I did a ton of them
and I did, you know, and another one around,
you know, some really cool, you know, one GSM, cause it's, you know, Archer and Olive is not
the only one GSM notebook just happens that we love them. But you know, it's not the only one GSM
notebook Maisie Lane is fantastic.

I love their notebooks. They're really great. And you know, STM , Scribbles That Matter is a bit of hit and miss because they, their paper is, I feel like their paper is
just a little bit more grainy and doesn't work as well as others. But that's again, it's because I've tasted
so many notebooks. I'm not just talking out of my ass. – But do you think it was because of your affiliation
with Archer and Olive. They also came at you and
they thought it was like a take down video, like, oh
this is better than that. – I do feel like that's maybe
what was perceived from that. But you know, when you email
a company and you're like, Hey, can you help me
out with some questions? And they don't reply to you
or like leave you on seen.

It's like. – Yeah – Okay. – Yeah, I don't know if are you gonna keep up with like this
interview style stuff? 'Cause I think it's a super fun. – You know what I think
I may just do that. Well, I think I might do. I might do Erica next. – Well, I'm glad to be your
first, not just sloppy seconds. – Erica can be sloppy seconds you know, I was talking to, was talking to Meg this morning from Planners and Wine. – Wow okay. – And they are just fantastic. Like their podcast is really great. And she, we were talking about
something totally unrelated and she's like, but you so animated. Like you miss your
personality when you're doing crafty stuff. Like you don't see your personality and kind of that doesn't
really come through when you're doing… – Top down and stuff. – And she was right.
And I think I, you know, I think I've started kind of
adding a little bit more of that into my reels as well now. Cause I just, when I started
reels like two weeks ago.

– I was so proud of
you. I loved it so much. And I love how I've become
like the unofficial person to like show stuff to you're
like, is this okay? And I was like, it doesn't
have to be perfect. I absolutely think it's great. Just like the, try it out and do it and like show that I agree. I would actually
completely agree with her.

Like again, getting to know
you and like, you know, all this stuff that's up for like when you like come at me for showing too much in sneak peeks. Other than that though,
like it's fantastic. You never want to be on the
bad side with the sneak peeks. But I agree. I think it's so much fun. And that's why, when you were
saying you were doing these, I was like, my hand was up. I was like, do I want to
respond to that quickly? I was like, yes, I want to respond quickly because I think it's so fun. And I mean, I've thought
about like with the, you know, the hangout podcasts that I
keep starting in like stopping and restarting, I was thinking like– – Thanks for my advice. – Well what I'm saying is
that I want to do more of that, but I wasn't quite
sure on like how to, 'cause I'm such a fan
stickler for like audio and like making sure it's right. And then I've just kind of, 'cause I don't like listening to podcasts, but the audio is way off.

Yeah. Or you can, you can tell that it's
like not really whatever. So for me, I've been trying
to research different ways to do that so that I can
extract the audio for a podcast, not just like a video podcast. Do you think video podcasts
would be fun too, but something, you know, like Joe Rogan,
like when he's done, it's both again, a lot of
money's behind that show now, but I actually prefer listening
to something like that than I do watching it. But I know a lot of people who
prefer to watch versus just listening. Right? I think it probably all depends on where you're listening
to your podcast.

Right? If you're at home or if
you're in the car or whatever, but that was a big thing for me. And I want to have more
guests on, you know, that you're on that list and we'll talk about something non, like my thing I want to do
with that is obviously talk a little bit about the things
people are known for, but then talk about like other hobbies. So this was also exciting for
me cause I was like, well, let's see how this sounds like
it comes out because I might do the same thing and take
that idea and see what happens. Was someone ringing our door. – No it's notifications to tell
me that it's school pickup, but at school holidays,
'cause it's summer holidays. I don't know why it's
telling me at school pickup.

I'm like. (laughing) – School is knocking on your door. (laughing) He's in a show he's in the
other room watching a show. – Have you ordered? – So I think that's awesome
that you're doing more of that though. I think it's, I think it'll be super fun
because it also gets to see people that, I mean, every time, like I remember having that
first like design team meeting and everybody was on
camera and you're like, oh, that's what you look like. Like I remember the first
time I saw Rose, like, and I was like, I had
never seen her before.

She never posted a picture. And I was like, I can put a face to the curse
word you're typing at me now. It's so great. (laughing) – So many curse words that
we can't use on YouTube because we would be banned. – Yeah. And we want this to not be banned. – We want this to be just
to be a positive experience. But yes. – It has to be. – It has been fun though. I really appreciate you
being my face victim. So that's been helpful. – Yeah. – I think– – That was my, that was my reel dance. I hope you're ready for more
of this in the near future. – You know what? I'm going to edit something
in there with like music and like. (laughing) – That's fine. – I feel like we should end
with like a special, reel. – What is, why– – I don't know am just like
inventing a dance as I go. what's a been, do you wait, do you actually, do you see things and hear real music now where you're like, oh that wouldn't go with that song where you like bend with it, lean with it.

– Oh no, I hear sounds. I say the sounds out loud sometimes when I'm talking. (laughing) What was I? I was just, I got out of
the car the other day. I dropped the kids off at school. I got out of the car and what did I, I literally like was talking to myself. I was talking to myself.
I was like, I don't know, what are those voiceovers sound things? And I was like, oh my gosh, like it's just a part of my life now. It used to be worse early on with TikTok. I feel like I would just hear the songs in my head constantly. And then now that a lot
of those TikTok songs are on the radio. Like you hear them even more. – Were they songs from the radio? – Yeah. Like a lot of people, a lot of people will get their start. Like they'll like, they'll get their start on TikTok and then make it on the radio. So like the, I think
like the ABCDEFU like, that was a song– – We do that song like everyday.

– Yeah. I love it. I think it's great. That one. And then there's the, what's
that rock with it, whatever. Yeah. – Rock with it, lean
with it, snap with it. – So like that. Yeah, like that whole like remix thing was definitely on the radio first. And then now I just hear
it on the regular radio all the time. So it's funny. So it's like, you can't really escape it. I, or even sometimes it
was the Doja Cat, right. Doja cat is a Doja Cat says words like, you know, whatever, it has a little ding. And so it was a lot of
people who were like, oh, my coworkers think I'm straight. And it's like, you know, blah, blah, blah ding. And so like we would be
in the car doing that.

I did I think I did
that for something else, but I like didn't do it for that. It was like made of something. I don't know, a face or something else
that like the sound, but like we would hear it in the car and then I would be like
doing what was in the videos. And then sometimes I do just, I just say the thing that
happens, I don't know. I saw a totally random we're
going off on a random time to here, but I saw a thing on TikTok today with the girl with
Tourette's like legit has Tourette's but her Tiks
include sound clips and things from TikTok. Because like the things that she says, and she doesn't have control over will be like part of things
that I've heard. Yeah. It was interesting. (laughing) You're done now you're done. And I was like, oh, that sounds familiar. And she's like, yeah. I feel like I do that all the time. So yeah anyway. – Anyway so circling all the way back. I'm super glad to have had
you as my first victim.

I really appreciate you taking
the time to have a little chit chat as well. – It's super fun. I'm
glad we can work it out. Thanks for being super
flexible with your time and making this happen and I can't wait– – And I will link all
your information below – Below subscribe and
hit that bell, watch. – Is it still a bell? This is how I this is how long I've
been out of the game. I'm like, is it still a bell? – It's a bell to bell subscribing bell, but it's not you, but
you don't need to say it because people like your content, they will subscribe and
hit the bell on their own.

So by saying it makes
them not want to click it. So don't. – Okay just look cute for a second look cute so they like us and they click. (laughing) We're silly. – I know hat's why I
love you so much awesome. Well, have a wonderful
rest of your summer day. I will be going into my summer. I'm sorry. I you have a good rest of your summer day. 'Cause I'm going into my
winter evening right now. – It has been an amazing evening and thank you so much for your time.

– 27 degrees Fahrenheit. So. – 27 Degrees Fahrenheit. What's that like zero? – I don't know what it is in Celsius. I don't do that. It's cold. (laughing) – Its warm here today, so. Alright, well I'll speak to you soon and thank you again. – Yeah, no problem. I'll talk to you, see ya. – Bye. – Bye..

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